UK comic book sales figures?

presterjohn · Post by **presterjohn** » 17 May 2006, 20:11

Hi, I was wondering if any of you guys can tell me how I can get hold of the sales figures for British comics?

My reason for wanting them is because I spend a lot of time on the American comic book artist John Byrne's web site and we frequently debate why comics that sold at one time 200,000 issues a month now only sell 35,000. The general opinion given my JB and most of the forum members is that because Marvel and DC have abandoned the younger reader in favour of the adult they have cut off the supply of new younger readers. This makes some sense I guess but I feel that there is a lot more to it i.e the high price of comics and the fact that every childs home now seems to have Sky TV (childrens channels) and at least one games console.

As the UK still does have the same titles (Beano and Dandy) available in the same places (newsagents) as we have had since my youth in the 70's I thought it would be a much more accurate barometer o wht is actually going on.

Any opinions as well as facts would be most welcome.

Lew Stringer · Post by **Lew Stringer** » 17 May 2006, 21:38

If you check this site:
http://www.abc.org.uk/

and type in the title of a comic, you may get a figure. (For example, Toxic has an average circulation of 47,000). Not all comics/mags declare their sales though.

As for why sales have declined: I strongly feel that other media has little to do with it. After all, Japan is the home of the video game yet Manga sales are huge!

Price and format are a factor I think. Publishers have valued style over content to an extent, with glossy full colour being considered more important than story pages. Again, this may explain why sales are so much better in Japan, when a comic like Weekly Jump has little colour, is printed on the poorest paper imaginable, yet has nearly 500 pages an issue.

It's all about perceived value. In the sixties a British comic cost the same as a bar of chocolate or a bag of crisps. Now comics cost four times the price of a chocolate bar and could be read faster than a Mars bar could be eaten! A kid with limited pocket money is less likely to buy a comic under those circumstances.

Lew

colcool007 · Post by **colcool007** » 17 May 2006, 23:29

I have to agree with Lew, but his mutlipier is out!

Average cost of pocket money crisps is about 35 pence (7/- to older peeps!

) Average cost of comic is ?1.80 or even more.

So while it is good that kids have a big selection of comics (even though most are TV tie-ins) to buy, the difference in price and spending power means that they will probably buy less comics than we did as kids.

I will give an example. A colleague of mine got the princely sum of 50 pence a week in the 70's. This meant that he could buy 5 comics a week and still have change. The kid of today needs to be getting ?10 a week to buy the same amount of comics.

While the relevance to the original topic is marginal,

I am sure that the disparity in spending power has had more than its' fair share of effect on declining sales.

The only comics that I can think of that are even close in spending terms are Beano and Dandy as both are only about 3 times the price of a packet of crisps and when I got the Beano, it was only 2 pence for crisps and 5 pence for a Beano. I will now get me jacket as it is obvious that pudding has not been served in the old folks home!

presterjohn · Post by **presterjohn** » 17 May 2006, 23:57

Thanks for the info on Toxic. I had no idea it sold that many copies. In the States that would be considered a very healthy title indeed these days. I have to say I agree with the comparisons with manga books. The nearest we have to them in the UK I would guess would be Marvel's Essential line. These 550 page books are black and white and printed on newsprint and available from Amazon at around ?7.50 thats great value if all you want is great stories to read. I think far to much interest has gone into the colouring work and paper stock used by Marvel and DC today. Sure it looks great but at such a high cost to the consumer.

Lew Stringer · Post by **Lew Stringer** » 18 May 2006, 01:54

presterjohn wrote:Thanks for the info on Toxic. I had no idea it sold that many copies. In the States that would be considered a very healthy title indeed these days.

Even more impressive that Toxic comes out twice a month. Viz sells even more: an average of 112,000 copies an issue.

So, several UK titles regularly outsell the US comics produced by "hot" creators. But do we get flown out to the San Diego Con? Nah.

Lew

Shaqui · Post by **Shaqui** » 18 May 2006, 06:19

Figures from previous years can be found in the press directories held at the British Newspaper Library. Hence:

http://www.technodelic.pwp.blueyonder.c ... Comics.htm

johnfreeman96 · Post by **johnfreeman96** » 18 May 2006, 17:36

I just updated my very simple list of titles and known sales figures on http://www.downthetubes.net/resources/c ... sales.html

Lew Stringer · Post by **Lew Stringer** » 18 May 2006, 20:54

johnfreeman96 wrote:I just updated my very simple list of titles and known sales figures on http://www.downthetubes.net/resources/c ... sales.html

One slight correction John; Toxic is published fortnighty, so there's 26 issues a year not 16.

Best,
Lew

presterjohn · Post by **presterjohn** » 18 May 2006, 22:27

Thanks for all that terrific stuff. Reading it seems to answer the question that is being posed in the USA about why comics are failing as a medium. Sadly it looks like it really is just because other things are taking up kids time rather than because the content is aimed at older readers.

Lew Stringer · Post by **Lew Stringer** » 18 May 2006, 23:18

presterjohn wrote:Thanks for all that terrific stuff. Reading it seems to answer the question that is being posed in the USA about why comics are failing as a medium. Sadly it looks like it really is just because other things are taking up kids time rather than because the content is aimed at older readers.

When you say comics, I presume you mean standard 32 page comics? I understand Mad and the US edition of Shonen Jump still sell extremely well? One major reason being they're sold on newsstands wheras most Marvel & DC comics are not now.

I can't see other distractions playing a large part in falling sales. As I said above, manga sales are huge in Japan, and the Japanese also love video games etc. Comic sales are also higher in Europe than in the USA.

Could it be that pricing, format, and "decompressed" story arcs are putting American kids off standard 32 page comics? (Plus the fact that unless they stumble across a comic store they won't actually find such comics?)

When I hear of success stories like Tokyopop, Viz Comics and their 200 page digest size Manga being so popular with kids in the USA and UK it leads me to believe that it's not comics that are failing as a medium but the standard format that has fallen out of favour.

Lew

chrissmillie · Post by **chrissmillie** » 18 May 2006, 23:31

Yeah, MAD. DC Comics biggest seller. Somehow never gets mentioned though.

Chris

johnfreeman96 · Post by **johnfreeman96** » 19 May 2006, 07:14

Lew Stringer wrote:
One slight correction John; Toxic is published fortnighty, so there's 26 issues a year not 16.

Best,
Lew

Thanks Lew. I want to update the prices and frequencies for the page but didn't have time yesterday.

Just to note, not all titles are ABC rated: not many of Titan's are, for example, so the page is reliant on info from those within the companies concerned or contributors.

presterjohn · Post by **presterjohn** » 19 May 2006, 22:30

When I hear of success stories like Tokyopop, Viz Comics and their 200 page digest size Manga being so popular with kids in the USA and UK it leads me to believe that it's not comics that are failing as a medium but the standard format that has fallen out of favour.

I think that is a very valid point. Even diehard comic fans seem to be switching to the trades these days. That is to an extent true for me as well. I had been picking up Pannini's Ultimate X-Men until I realised I could buy a years worth of Ultimate X-Men in Hardback for only ?13.00 on Amazon. Price wise it is fantastic value compared to the monthlies and the 4 volumes I have bought so far look nicer on the shelf than a stack of comics would.

johnfreeman96 · Post by **johnfreeman96** » 19 May 2006, 22:55

presterjohn wrote:When I hear of success stories like Tokyopop, Viz Comics and their 200 page digest size Manga being so popular with kids in the USA and UK it leads me to believe that it's not comics that are failing as a medium but the standard format that has fallen out of favour.

I think that is a very valid point. Even diehard comic fans seem to be switching to the trades these days. That is to an extent true for me as well. I had been picking up Pannini's Ultimate X-Men until I realised I could buy a years worth of Ultimate X-Men in Hardback for only ?13.00 on Amazon. Price wise it is fantastic value compared to the monthlies and the 4 volumes I have bought so far look nicer on the shelf than a stack of comics would.

I don't think there's any easy answer to a reduction in sales. I think the market in the US, in particular, didn't help itself by overextending itself with foil covers and a huge increase in the number of series being launched in the 1990s.

The pressure on us at Marvel UK, where I worked, to produce a range of titles for the US market was enormous, and despite the best efforts of all involved, ot was near impossible to maintain the high standards set in the first US books produced under Paul Neary's direction, which had huge sales that dwarf a best selling Marvel or DC book today.

The market imploded and the industry lost confidence in itself: when you ose sales, you lose the 'spare money' to promote your product, and you lose out to other leisure products, whose rising sales enavle them to use 'spare money' to promote themselves over comics, books etc. The budgets to promote computer games and new music are truly incredible compared with the budgets of almost every comics company.

Tokyopop's success must surely be in part becuase they have recognised the need to market thier product to sell it -- something not recognised in the UK by some comic companies. Even at a relatively small convention like the Bristol Comics Festival (compared with the size of US events), TP had a massive stall, put on signings.

Is it any surprise then that people are more aware of TPs range? yes the price plays a factor, but promotion doesn't half help something sell...

presterjohn · Post by **presterjohn** » 19 May 2006, 23:20

Its interesting that the sales of books like V for Vendetta shot through the roof when the film was released and yet sales of Spider-Man the FF and the X-Men (both as comics and trades) only gently increased for a while and yet thousands more went to see the superhero movies compared to V. You would think a hot movie would be the best form of advertising ever.

Comics UK