Ncuti Gatwa Axed From Dr Who

[jim244]

Obviously I won't discuss politics or encourage such on this forum.
But I will say that Ncuti (the current Dr Who) was meant to do the Eurovision England link and didn't.
This was apparently due to his pro Palenstinian views.
And got sacked.
The series has had terrible viewing figures and is going to be dropped by Disney.
Therefore I presumed he would be going and the series would return with a new Dr in a couple of years once alternative funding was found.
I AM SHOCKED THAT HE WAS SACKED.
I personally prefer the old series and of the new series, I frankly never saw him show the gravatis that the character needed.
UNTIL LAST WEEK....
NCUTI NAILED IT LAST EPISODE and I said to my wife....Bloody heck, he's actually really good....
Then he got sacked.
Thoughts anyone?

[Adam Eterno]

Wow! You continued to watch it after the first 3 episodes!? 4 Dr Who fans I know, including me, gave up early. It was rubbish! We’re all so different too. Aged in our 20s, 30s, 60s and 70s. One non white, one Muslim and all with completely different social backgrounds but all Whovians who had problems with the last doctor, but couldn’t handle Gatwa at all. My personal moment was the song and dance routine in the Abbey Rd studios. 2 of the others lost it with the babies in space.
Funnily, I was watching Ecclestone only this morning in the gas mask episode and it was so much better.

[starscape]

Didn't watch his first season after the first 10 minutes of the Xmas special, but I've really enjoyed about 80% of these series 2 shows. Very inventive storytelling.
Ncuti is a good actor. Although I prefer the miserableness of Hartnell and Capaldi, and don't like wimpy Davison and Whittaker. I'm still hoping Olivia Coleman will be asked (even if she might be too mega star to accept).

[stevezodiac]

She's currently in a Warburton's advert so it's possible.

[jim244]

Wow! You continued to watch it after the first 3 episodes!? 4 Dr Who fans I know, including me, gave up early. It was rubbish! We’re all so different too. Aged in our 20s, 30s, 60s and 70s. One non white, one Muslim and all with completely different social backgrounds but all Whovians who had problems with the last doctor, but couldn’t handle Gatwa at all. My personal moment was the song and dance routine in the Abbey Rd studios. 2 of the others lost it with the babies in space.
Funnily, I was watching Ecclestone only this morning in the gas mask episode and it was so much better.

I also had a problem with Gatwas' first series.
The Xmas Special with Goblins was perhaps the worst Dr Who episode I have ever seen until "Space Babies".
I switched off "Space Babies" after a few minutes.
I watched the rest of the series and enjoyed a couple of episodes but whilst I was initially delighted with the return of Sutekh, I was rather perturbed that he was treated like a dog on a chain in the conclusion.
As you say: Absolute rubbish.
However, I have enjoyed Gatwas' second series, it's been far better.

[jim244]

Didn't watch his first season after the first 10 minutes of the Xmas special, but I've really enjoyed about 80% of these series 2 shows. Very inventive storytelling.
Ncuti is a good actor. Although I prefer the miserableness of Hartnell and Capaldi, and don't like wimpy Davison and Whittaker. I'm still hoping Olivia Coleman will be asked (even if she might be too mega star to accept).

We have very similar views on this Starscape.
I would just add that I think Whittaker is a great actor but was given terrible scripts (in general).
Must admit I recently re-watched Jodies' second series and compared to Gatwas' first series her episodes look like Star Wars vs Playschool.
Just have to also note: I share your love for Hartnell and Capaldi but I do really love Davison.
Being a bit controversial, whilst I love many of their episodes, Tennant and Troughton are not in my personal top 5 Drs.
Coleman would also be a first choice for me.

[jim244]

She's currently in a Warburton's advert so it's possible.

Crumpets or bread Steve ?
(Cue many references to Talkie The Toaster from Red Dwarf)

[jim244]

I would just like to add that I thought both Whittaker and Davison suffered from having too many companions in the Tardis.
Only Hartnell had had so many before but Bill was a really amazing actor and probably the best thespian in the role and his co stars were absolutely brilliant in their own right, in my opinion.

[starscape]

I would just add that I think Whittaker is a great actor but was given terrible scripts (in general).
Must admit I recently re-watched Jodies' second series and compared to Gatwas' first series her episodes look like Star Wars vs Playschool.

Being a bit controversial, whilst I love many of their episodes, Tennant and Troughton are not in my personal top 5 Drs.

It wasn't really about her acting skills, more about her character. The nearest I could get to was Davison. Both too vulnerable for me. Not a big fan of Troughton either, although thought Tennant was great and with fabulous scripts.

I had a thought about that. I'm not a big fan of Matt Smith. His episodes were very much children's stories compared with the before and after. Likewise, Ncuti's episodes are also quite glossy and stylised. Maybe we should be seeing the Doctors as we do James Bonds. We don't really expect Sean Connery, Roger Moore and Daniel Craig to have much in common, even down to the scripts. Some are very boy's adventure stories, whilst others are for a more mature audience. Adam West's Batman has nothing in common with the Dark Knight trilogy, except some names. Different doctors for different needs. As much as I love the Time Machine 60s film, it's very different from the book. And that's fine.

[jim244]

I would just add that I think Whittaker is a great actor but was given terrible scripts (in general).
Must admit I recently re-watched Jodies' second series and compared to Gatwas' first series her episodes look like Star Wars vs Playschool.

Being a bit controversial, whilst I love many of their episodes, Tennant and Troughton are not in my personal top 5 Drs.

It wasn't really about her acting skills, more about her character. The nearest I could get to was Davison. Both too vulnerable for me. Not a big fan of Troughton either, although thought Tennant was great and with fabulous scripts.

I had a thought about that. I'm not a big fan of Matt Smith. His episodes were very much children's stories compared with the before and after. Likewise, Ncuti's episodes are also quite glossy and stylised. Maybe we should be seeing the Doctors as we do James Bonds. We don't really expect Sean Connery, Roger Moore and Daniel Craig to have much in common, even down to the scripts. Some are very boy's adventure stories, whilst others are for a more mature audience. Adam West's Batman has nothing in common with the Dark Knight trilogy, except some names. Different doctors for different needs. As much as I love the Time Machine 60s film, it's very different from the book. And that's fine.

A very different and insightful view and interesting point.
For the record: My favourite Batman is the comic book version from the 70s/80s/90s but live actor wise Adam West hands down.
Why? Just such a really lovely person in real life ,Adam was hilarious, kind , hugely intelligent and actually got confused with separating his Batman persona with his real life persona.
His wife wasn't happy when he ran after a thief on a beach and held him until the police arrived, much to the cheers of the people that had been stolen from.
Never met the guy but email etc and he was a FB friend of my mate and would ask after his kids etc.
ABSOLUTE LEGEND AND REAL LIFE SUPER HERO.
Sorry I think I went slightly off topic then ..........
Either way: Excellent point Starscape.

[jim244]

Just to briefly add to the above in addressing your comments Starscape:
1: I think Davison's Doctor was deliberately constructed to be vulnerable to counter act against Toms' Demi-God of the previous 7 years .
2: I didn't personally find Jodies Dr vulnerable, I got bored with a speech every week to the audience, it was too "woke" for me as in trying to educate the populace with certain idealogies that were half thought out left of centre liberal dogma.
3: I think Pat was a fantastic actor but , like you, don't get all the fan service his way and am angry when I read so many times that he was " The FIRST real Dr". It is so demeaning to the ACTUAL FIRST Dr, Mr William Hartnell.
4: You make a great point about Matt Smith although personally I massively enjoyed a lot of his episodes BUT you are right in what you say.
5: Tennant was incredible in many episodes and some of these were among the best ever written for the series. HOWEVER..personally when I look back I massively prefer Eccleston.I got a bit bored with Tennants' magic wand Harry Potter type stuff.

[starscape]

I'm all for liberal ideaologies. Beats the hell out of this hard right division and hatred permeating through the US and Europe these days. I didn't even think the stories were too bad in Whittaker's run, although obviously aimed at a much younger audience than me. I don't think that's a bad thing. As I said, there's no reason series which entirely change everything periodically should always appeal to their previous audience. Who, Bond, Batman in movies, but also I know someone that love golden age comics. They're cute and an interesting snippet of the past but many simply unreadable. Notable exceptions like Plastic Man, but just try reading Green Lantern from the 40s (and I say that as someone who loved the return of the Earth 2 JSA). I loved the Dark Knight and Joker. The golden age junkie hates them as they're so far removed from Batman wearing rainbow costumes and flying to alien worlds.
Takes all sorts.

[jim244]

So....
I finally caught up with Saturdays' episode yesterday and I personally cannot help but believe that it's all got a bit too much "fan service" at this point.
What will todays' children and young parents make of the return of the Rani, the potential return of Omega and this continual Susan twist thing which must tie in with everything and mark the eventual return of Carole Ann Ford ??
Personally I see this as a problem for achieving a large audience.
I loved how the episode finally dealt with threads left open from last years "73 yards" and always enjoy a dystopian Orwellian future scenario but I'm unconvinced that using classic villians that were literally last century, other than iconic cultural ones such as the Daleks, is the right way forward.
It's all a bit fanzine wanX.
I may personally adore the return of Susan and such but I should not be the key target demographic.

[jim244]

Starscape "I'm all for liberal ideaologies. Beats the hell out of this hard right division and hatred permeating through the US and Europe these days".
Let me be clear: My Grandfather was a Liberal Councillor and my politics are left wing but my point is I don't believe in indoctrination.
I will friendly debate politics with friends of different views but coercion is uncomfortable, especially when aimed at a young audience.
One of my best mates is an Indian who emigrated to this country when he was a child and he supports the Reform Party and doesn't comprehend the racism that I see inherently as a foundation base for that political party.
We don't argue, we have a beer and politely discuss our different viewpoints.
My point is simple: I believe that politics , of what ever doctrine, have no place in what is essentially a kids show that adults that grew up with it still watch.

[jim244]

AND.... Back to my original point....
Without going into the Israel Palestine debate, I do not believe that an actor should be sacked due to his/her political views.