If we had a list of the 100 greatest serials in girls comics

[Phoenix]

That's not the first time I've heard that reasoning. Several people I know use that as the reason not to read comics.

As Lew knows, I'm not one of those people. I'm constantly reading and enjoying serials in picture story papers for boys or girls, and consequently I am equally constantly immersed in characters, plots and milieux imagined by writers and artists. I am automatically, therefore, accepting the limitations that have been placed on my imagination. I would prefer it not to be that way, but there is no way that I am going to deprive myself of the pleasure I inevitably get from those picture strip serials by refusing to read them on the grounds that they are not in text form. The point I thought I was making earlier relates to Tammyfan's assertion that everybody likes to see McGillivray's artwork. It is quite irrelevant to me who the artist is, in any case I simply wouldn't be able to link the artwork to a specific artist, nor would I wish to, because I'm basically prepared to accept what is put in front of me. I do get mildly irritated with any in-your-face artwork that seems to want to be more important than the story it is illustrating, but for the most part I'm comfortable with it.

[DavidKW]

As regards other suggestions:

I'll Never Leave You/Glenda Good & Bad: I saw these in later editions of June & thougth they might stir debate/memories, but clearly not memorable enough.

Nobody Knows my Name from JUne 1971-72 might've been a possibility - I've not seen much of the strip but its a strong idea of a girl in WW" who is found amongst bombings, but has no memory. Drawn by John Armstrong.

Another one I had suggested in case of any takers "Mini Mum" from Bunty in late 70s/early 80s? - I'd not make that a contenter for the list. Concept is good - a mother with a daughter gets miniaturised to doll size - and drawn well by Rob MacGillivray - but it also does seem that Rob MacG may have been missing Lucky's Living Doll perhaps (mind you it would've made a good LLD plot if Mrs Smith got miniaturized temporarily in a sci-fi twist - and Tina's got her work cut out to protect her, whilst not being exposed as a living doll).

[DavidKW]

As regards this discussion on artists:

A good artist and great plot together make a good strip; each to their own in both cases.

I will say there is something very eye-catching about Rob MacGillivray's work that draws me in though I don't know why it is with me.

As regards artists and plot importance - I don't particulary like the Luck's Living Dolls that were drawn by John Richardson in 1972-73, not just becasue he just couldn't draw it anywhere as good as Rob MacG, but also because the plots and stories were some of the worst & silliest LLDs ever.

(Also worsened by fact that Rob MacG was shunted onto drawing two of his worst strips ever - first the horrible "Cry Baby Chrissie" (a reject from Tammy?) then the very silly "Annie's Army").

As regards "Jeanie And Her Uncle Meanie", it was a good strip & idea & also, albeit briefly a survivor from Sandie's merger with Tammy; but it lacks that something to make it stand out, along with a now un-PC stereotype of Scots.

Rob MacGillivray did much better & stronger strips such as LLD, Trixie's Treasure Chest & Balloon of Doom, and improved Maisie's Magic Eye.

[DavidKW]

... and possibly others not yet thoguht of. I just remembered the gritty "The Double Life OF Sad Sarah" from Mandy on the unhappy families thread, I think one of his last works (posthumously published in 1987).

And Maypole & The Swimming Pool was a strong one in Schoolfriend in 1963, which preceded LLD. Neither would make list of 100 though.

[Lew Stringer]

That's not the first time I've heard that reasoning. Several people I know use that as the reason not to read comics.

As Lew knows, I'm not one of those people.

Sorry Phoenix. I hope it didn't come across that I was including you in that. I know you enjoy comics, as your contributions here have proven of course. I must admit though that I've never considered comic strips to be putting a limit on my imagination when I read them. I wouldn't have thought that a drawn image of a character or scene is any less of an imposition on my imagination than a prose description. Also, one is still using the imagination to quickly piece together the flow of action or a transition from one panel to another.

[Phoenix]

Sorry Phoenix. I hope it didn't come across that I was including you in that.

No, it didn't, Lew. I just felt that a more detailed explanation of my position would be useful.

I wouldn't have thought that a drawn image of a character or scene is any less of an imposition on my imagination than a prose description. Also, one is still using the imagination to quickly piece together the flow of action or a transition from one panel to another.

When we compare a text serial with its later picture version, the presentation in the strip is much less detailed in all areas, not just in the plot but in the characterisations too. This is inevitable because the text presentation can afford to be looser, and can spread itself out. Remember that a picture strip instalment can be read properly in about three minutes, whereas a text instalment will take you a minimum of fifteen. This difference will not be considered relevant by those picture strip readers who have never read a text serial, but I can remember looking at the first issue of The New Hotspur, which had a very attractive front cover, and being very disappointed by the balance, only two text tales, and a text episode of The Boyhood Of Desperate Dan, a total of just eight sides out of twenty-eight. I didn't buy it! I do have a copy now, of course, along with many hundreds more. But I am a researcher now as well as a reader.

[Tammyfan]

I guess Uncle Meanie shows how they could get away with a lot more in the 1970s compared to today. Nowadays the strip would not be allowed because it would not be considered PC because of the Scottish stereotype. Neither would The Black and White Minstrel Show, which was very popular in the 1970s.

Some old strips wouldn't be allowed today because they would be considered dated or non PC. One would be Bunty's 1967 story Sister of the Bride, where the protagonist keeps sabotaging her sister's career because she believes she should be getting married instead. It was probably popular in its day - I wouldn't know - but there is no way it would be reprinted in the modern Bunty. If it was still running, that is. Wow, twelve years since it folded?

Ah, so it is!

[Tammyfan]

I will look at The Sad Star and The Guardian Tree when I get the Mandys out of the garage.

[Tammyfan]

The list of possibilities now. I guess we just agree on which three (or something else) will advance, and that's it. Plus a list of honourable mentions.

1. A Leap in Time (Misty)
2. Captain Kate (June)
3. Climbing Rose (Judy)
4. Cloris and Claire (June)
5. Come Home Kathleen (Bunty)
6. Dilly Dream (School Friend)
7. Hetty in the House of Secrets (Spellbound)
8. Jane, Model Miss (Diana)
9. Justine For Justice (Sally)
10. Kathy Of Marvin Grange (June)
11. Mary Jo (Princess - first series)
12. My School Chum Mum (Bunty)
13. School for Snobs (Tammy)
14. Slave to the Dolls (Tracy)
15. The Bennets of Ballet (Bunty)
16. The Fairground of Fear
17. The Guardian Tree (Mandy)
18. The Sad Star (Mandy)
19. The Sorrows of Supergirl (Tracy)
20. Time after Time [1999] (Bunty)
21. Tilly Tuffin (Princess Tina)


Somebody please explain
Climbing Rose (Judy)
The Bennets of Ballet (Bunty)
Come Home Kathleen (Bunty)
Dilly Dream (School Friend)
Hetty in the House of Secrets (Spellbound)
Mary Jo (Princess - first series)
Jane, Model Miss (Diana)
Tina Tuffin (Princess Tina)

I'm also wondering if Kathy of Marvin Grange (one of my nominees) is strong enough. It was a June regular featuring the exploits of Kathy and her friends at Marvin Grange School. Seems it was popular, but that may not be enough to advance it.

[Phoenix]

The Bennetts Of Ballet : BUNTY (1964)

This is a series of completes about young Margot Bennett and her family's business, Bennett's Travelling Ballet, a company that tours the country presenting ballet shows in small towns or villages where such shows are not normally seen. To all intents and purposes, each episode follows the same pattern. There is a problem to be resolved either before they reach their destination or after they get there, problems with equipment, the venue commandeered for some more important function, that sort of thing. One example should suffice. On one occasion, while they are stranded due to a breakdown, they are invited to see an exhibition by local tradesmen in the only hall that would have been suitable for a performance. Margot is underwhelmed by the layout of the smart clothes on their rescuer Mr Bayliss's stand, and learning that he is essentially relying on orders after the event to save his business, Margot gets him to agree to the Bennett company wearing the clothes, initially standing like dummies but then presenting a ballet routine that is very well received. Orders pour in, and Mr Bayliss is invited by the mayor to bring the ballet company to entertain the guests at that night's Trade Fair Civic Ball. The Bennetts are well rewarded financially by Mr Bayliss. Their toast always falls butter side up!

In my opinion this series is too repetitive and therefore does not merit a place in the Top 100.

[Phoenix]

Jane - Model Miss : DIANA (1971)

This is not the only appearance of Jane Morgan, who runs a boutique with her mother, but I do have all the instalments of this one. She is in Greece attending an International Fashion Festival, and is very taken by some gorgeous (her word, not mine!) and very unusual golden material. Despite there being only enough to make six evening dresses, she buys it all, and has the dresses made up there. She is back in England when they arrive at the boutique. She soon notices that there is a dot-dash texture in parts of the material, that she hadn't noticed in Greece. She puts on a fashion show and the golden dresses sell like hot cakes. Shortly afterwards, a Secret Service agent, Mr Barker of M.I.5.Y-Special Codes Section, turns up to buy all the six dresses. Apparently they had got the six normal dresses that Jane should have been sent, and vice versa. As Mr Barker is unwilling to let an enemy know they have lost the vital message embedded in the dresses, he tells Jane that it is up to her to get all the dot-dash dresses back. The remaining ten instalments deal with her quest. As the owners are not at all keen to relinquish their classy purchase, Jane needs to resort to all kinds of inventive strategies, including entering one owner's house through a window, and sometimes to the point of damaging the dresses to ensure that their new owners will take them off. Her quest is not helped by the fact that she is soon aware that she has just given a job to a female enemy agent. She succeeds in the end, of course, but the energy, gymnastic skills and bravery required of her in her successful quest for the last dress do require more than the usual suspension of disbelief.

In my opinion, this serial is a contender.

[Phoenix]

Hetty In The House Of Secrets : SPELLBOUND (1977)

This serial is set seemingly sometime in the Eighteenth Century. Hetty Farlane's widowed mother has been appointed as a governess to Alan and Kirsty Calder, who live with their father in Calder Towers, situated somewhere in the bleak Welsh mountains. Mr Calder introduces his children, claiming that they are his entire family, but Hetty has seen a woman at an upstairs window. We eventually learn that she is Arlene Calder, the evil late wife of Mr Calder, who has a major influence on events in this story. There is a portrait of her in the upstairs room, and somehow she is able to materialise in order to make mischief for Hetty and her mother. She is able to do this by taking over Alan's mind, through whom his late mother's messages are communicated to Kirsty, and the two then set out to do her bidding while under her influence and control. For the readers who have suspended their disbelief, this ten-instalment serial is tightly plotted, exciting, full of incident, and makes sense. Most at risk is Hetty because she is being manipulated by Alan and Kirsty into situations where, when challenged by Mr Calder, who is completely unaware of his children's malevolent activities, her true version of the events is made to appear less plausible than the children's lies. However, at one point, when it seems very likely that Mr Calder is going to ask Mrs Farlane to marry him, the late Arlene gets so distraught that she decides that mother and daughter both have to die. Light is shed on the current situation by a tribe of gipsies. Apparently in 1718 Arlene Calder was deeply in love, and betrothed to the handsome Guy Farlane, but he fell in love with a gipsy girl called Maria and married her. Arlene could not forgive him and hired a band of men who destroyed the gipsy settlement, killing many men and burning many caravans in the process. Arlene now gets Alan and Kirsty to burn down the current settlement, but Hetty stops it, although she is caught with an oil-can and a tinder box in her hands. She pleads for Alan and Kirsty as she now realises that they are being manipulated. The gipsies believe Hetty because she is a Farlane, not a Calder. One of them, a wise gipsy called Clara starts a search for a buried bottle containing a curse on the Calders in order to destroy it, so destroying Arlene's evil spirit. Meanwhile, Arlene gets Kirsty to persuade Mrs Farlane to ride through the woods in search of Hetty, where she rides straight into a marsh, from which she is rescued by some of the gipsies, and reunited with Hetty. The bottle is found, and Arlene is destroyed when the spirit is released. Mr Calder, Mrs Farlane and Hetty all witness her final wispy death throes, although the adults are totally unable to comprehend what they are seeing. So, as the bard would have it, All's well that ends well.

In my opinion, this is a quality story and should advance.

[helsbels]

Thanks for the summary of Hetty in The House Of Secrets, Phoenix. It's a great story and I think it deserves a place in the top 100. I first read it way back in 1977 when I used to get Spellbound every week and I never forgot it. I think it has shades of "The Turn of The Screw" about it, with the possessed children persecuting Hetty and her mother.

[Tammyfan]

I was curious about Hetty in the House of Secrets too. Thanks for the information.

[Marionette]

I don't know if School for Snobs eventually became a "snob of the week" format, but the sequel series I've seen so far take several episodes to "cure" the snobs. And they invariably follow the format of "nasty girl attempts to put one over on the headmistress and fails repeatedly until the final page of the story when she has a change of heart and is completely cured".

The same plot is used for "Skivers' School" except the girls are lazy, rather than snobby. They even have the same artist. Later episodes of "School for Snobs" have a superior artist who makes an effort to draw in the same style, but the line quality and attention to detail are far superior.

I find it dull, repetitive, and entirely superficial.