Comics UK

That list seems fine to me, Tammyfan, and once we have the 100 Honourable Mentions in place, we can introduce promotion and relegation. As you realise, over time quite a number of story titles have occurred to us all that were thought possibly worthy of inclusion in the Top 100, like your suggestion this morning. There will surely be a lot more. So if we look at the contenders for the 100 Honourable Mentions list with the sort of analysis we have been using recently, we may well find that we are putting some of those in the Top 100 under some serious pressure to come forward and justify their place there. Do you agree?

Phoenix wrote:That list seems fine to me, Tammyfan, and once we have the 100 Honourable Mentions in place, we can introduce promotion and relegation. As you realise, over time quite a number of story titles have occurred to us all that were thought possibly worthy of inclusion in the Top 100, like your suggestion this morning. There will surely be a lot more. So if we look at the contenders for the 100 Honourable Mentions list with the sort of analysis we have been using recently, we may well find that we are putting some of those in the Top 100 under some serious pressure to come forward and justify their place there. Do you agree?

Oh yes, that's sure to happen. Hmm, I hadn't thought about how many honourable mentions to have, but 100 of them may be a bit too much pressure on the top 100. Perhaps limit the number to 50?

Btw, do you want to see a proper synopsis of The Forbidden Garden?

Tammyfan wrote:Oh yes, that's sure to happen. Hmm, I hadn't thought about how many honourable mentions to have, but 100 of them may be a bit too much pressure on the top 100. Perhaps limit the number to 50?

I think you may be surprised by the number of candidates. I suspect that members might have felt that during the compilation of the Top 100, they were essentially only being invited to make decisions on the smallish number of stories that were summarised. If the total doesn't reach 100 we can review it then, but I could recommend more than 50 from Thomsons' output that haven't been mentioned so far. This would suggest that you and other Fleetway aficionados could come up with another 50.

I think I'd better get our list over to Pat Mills and see what he thinks. Maybe he will have some ideas for the list and honourable mentions.

Tammyfan wrote:I think I'd better get our list over to Pat Mills and see what he thinks. Maybe he will have some ideas for the list and honourable mentions.

What on earth has Pat Mills to do with our lists? I can't imagine our members being at all happy at having their Top 100 choices removed, and replaced, by suggestions from someone who isn't a member of comicsuk. His reputation is quite unimportant where our lists are concerned. That apart, I thought we were going to leave the Top 100 as it is until such time as we have some persuasive candidates from the Honourable Mentions list, and we haven't got any in there yet. In my opinion. we should focus now on our suggestions for inclusion in the Honourable Mentions list, putting stories forward with summaries, and inviting comment. We have spent loads of time already on the Top 100 so I think it should stay as it is for a good few months. We need to be more clear-sighted now than we were with the Top 100. You have suggested a list of 50 possibles. Fine, let's wait until we have 50, and then we should put to the test those stories that are currently in the Top 100, but have not been summarised and then approved, and set them against those we will have approved for inclusion in the 50 Honourable Mentions. Replacements may well then follow.

I mentioned a few times before that I wanted a Pat Mills opinion and nobody raised objections. Also, Pat Mills was a very useful authority when the top tens for Tammy and Jinty were compiled. And I'm sure he'd love to see the list. Anyway, I've already asked him, and he's been sent a link to our thread.

I'm not going to argue with you over your decision to invite input from outsiders unless you then start to allow that input to disturb the Top 100, which, while not set in stone, has effectively been chosen by our forum members. Personally, I am perfectly capable of deciding on the qualities, or lack of them, of any serial without needing reassurance from others. And do bear in mind that the type of serials that Pat Mills seems to work best with are within a somewhat limited range, as far as I recall, and as a result, he might only find half a dozen that match his views. Perhaps you could encourage him to join comicsuk so we can talk to him face to face, so to speak.

Now for a few classics from Jinty. I am starting with The Forbidden Garden as this one has been on my mind lately:

Publication: 24/3/79-28/7/79
Repeat: Tammy - unfinished due to Tammy's cancellation
Artist: Jim Baikie
Writer: Unknown

Plot: Mankind has polluted the atmosphere, causing plants to become extinct and soil incapable of growing any. The plants that do survive are protected in laboratories, and parks, gardens etc are filled with plastic substitutes. The pollution and lack of plants also means water and food are strictly rationed, and other harsh measures are sometimes taken, such as destroying pets because they are a strain on food supplies. People have dumped them in the Forbidden Zone instead, where they are growing wild (watch this).

Laika Severn's sister Valli is extremely ill, but her parents cannot afford hospital care (for the rich only). Valli wishes to see a real flower, but where to get one? Then, one day Laika trespasses into the Forbidden Zone. To her astonishment, she finds a patch of earth with grass growing in it. As she explores further, she discovers evidence that the patch once belonged to a gardener. She finds seed packets and immediately sees her chance to grow a flower for Valli.

But the seeds need water, and that poses a problem in this water-rationed society. Eventually Laika is driven to steal water from school (an imprisonable offence). However, she is photographed by the meanest prefect in the school, Gladvis Clampp. Gladvis starts blackmailing Laika into doing dirty, exhausting (and illegal) work at her uncle's factory in exchange for more water.

Nonetheless, the seeds start sprouting. Laika finds a water source in an old washroom (the authorities forgot to turn off the pipes). Now Laika has no need for her water wages from Gladvis' uncle, but she is still being blackmailed. Then Gladvis orders Laika up to her room to clean it (purposely untidied for Laika). But Laika manages to break into Gladvis's safe, where she discovers a hoard of material that has clearly being used for not only blackmailing her but others as well. She destroys the evidence, freeing her fellow victims as well as herself. Her act also sets off sprinkler systems and sends Gladvis running!

Later that evening, Laika finds that her plants seem to be growing at an unusually fast rate. Another problem are the animals that have been dumped in the zone - they have grown ferocious and dangerous, and could kill people.

Next day, Gladvis takes a terrible revenge. She contrives to have her father (Mr Severn's manager) demote Mr Severn to C Worker, which forces the family to relocate to the dreaded industrial zone. However, before she leaves for the industrial zone, Laika tells her friend Kara Stayn about Gladvis and urges her to pass the word around. In earshot is Miss Karvell, a teacher with a reputation for favouring Gladvis.

The industrial zone is a depressing, dreadful place to live in. It is seriously polluted, forcing people to live in shabby rundown flats located underground. School is a dump with no lessons at all and filled with rough kids. Worst of all, there is no way out of the industrial zone - once you are there, you are stuck there for life. Only Valli remains cheerful because Laika promised her a flower. But Laika cannot even wangle a pass to get to her plants.

Then, Laika is surprised when the child protection force arrives, takes her away, and puts her in with Kara's family. They have received information that she is brilliant; brilliant children are placed in the care of the force and given privileges. This means a forced, heartbreaking separation from her family. On the other hand, it also means a return to her old school, a chance to bone up on horticulture in the library for the sake of her plants, and to see them again. When she does, she finds they are growing at a phenomenal rate and wonders if there is something odd about them. She is also puzzled as to how she got into the protection of the force, because she is intelligent but not brilliant. She begins to wonder if she has a secret friend.

The rainfall (programmed so water can be collected) is advanced, and Laika goes into the Forbidden Zone as she fears her plants will be damaged. But Kara follows and suffers a head injury in a flooded underground passage. Laika also makes a slip about her garden. When they get out, they are caught by the police for curfew-breaking (imprisonable offence). But Miss Karvell comes and, to Laika's surprise, gets them off the hook. However, Kara's parents are furious with Laika over what happened.

Next day, Laika finds out that Miss Karvell is her secret friend. It turns out that Miss Karvell and other staff members were among the victims that Laika freed from Gladvis. In return, Miss Karvell contrived to get Laika out of the industrial zone and into the child protection force by falsifying her school records. She asks Laika to confide in her as she suspects a problem; Laika asks to keep things secret a little longer. Miss Karvell also says that Valli has worsened and nearing death. This prompts Laika to go to her garden to see if her plants have bloomed in time for Valli.

They have, but they are hideous mutants. Shocked, Laika smashes them, and then tears up the seed packets and throws the seed around. She heads back to Kara's, where another shock awaits. In a state of delirium, Kara rambles about "Laika's garden". Fearing the police will soon arrest her for trespass in the Forbidden Zone, Laika heads back to it, collecting food rations on the way. But the rats eat her rations and the wild animals force her to barricade herself into the washroom. Hunger drives her out in search of more rations. But rain followed by sun have created a dense fog and she gets lost. Meanwhile, the police force things out of the weakened Kara and head to the zone to look for Laika.

Suddenly, Laika smells a heady perfume. It is so powerful she can follow it, even in the fog. It leads straight back to her garden. Laika is astonished to find her garden is a tropical paradise!

And here is what happens in the finale:

Next is Village of Fame. This one seems to be popular in Jinty discussions, so here we go.


Publication: 4/8/79-24/11/79
Artist: Jim Baikie
Writer: Unknown

Plot: Sue Parker is notorious for her overactive imagination that is fuelled by too much television and boredom because nothing ever happens in her village, which is called Fame. Then real excitement starts when Major Grenfield rents out the old manor. The official reason is that Mr Grand of IBC TV studios wants to film a festival in Fame (with snobby Angela Grenfield as festival princess) but Sue overhears his employees saying that Grand has something far more exciting planned. Sue’s imagination goes into overdrive as to what this means, and starts getting ideas about spies. In a way it does turn out to be spying – Grand wants to start filming day-to-day lives of the villagers. The villagers are thrilled at being TV stars, but Sue is not keen on cameras being installed everywhere in Fame to film them, and she does not trust Grand.

Things get suspicious when Grand seems to send one of his employees in to set the Parker family quarrelling in front of the cameras. Even worse, he shows it to the whole village as his first episode, so everyone thinks that is how the Parkers behave in private. It is huge publicity for his serial, and Sue’s sister Jane lets it all go to her head, especially when she starts getting fan mail. When Sue sees another camera, she tells it, and Grand, that she is going to fight him and starts a petition. Grand’s response is to plant his niece, Mandy Walters in Sue’s school. She pretends to be sympathetic to Sue. Mandy stages a drowning accident where Sue rescues her. Grand is filming and he hopes being a star in an episode will win her over. However, Mandy is angry that her uncle did not uphold his end of the bargain and sets out to wreck his serial – by telling Sue the truth! Sue and Mandy are now reluctant allies, although Sue does not really trust Mandy.

More things happen that look suspiciously like publicity stunts engineered by Grand to liven up his serial. A teacher, Miss Pebblestone, is accused of a fire at school. Sue suspects this is another of Grand’s schemes, as Mandy said he had plans for Miss Pebblestone. The cameras have recorded everything, but Sue suspects fake shots to frame Miss Pebblestone. Grand graciously agrees to destroy the film, but Miss Pebblestone is forced to leave the school. Grand arranges a bus tour; Sue’s brother Jason gets lost, and Sue suspects Mandy was part of it. Then Grand throws a party with sinister entertainment – Marvo the hypnotist, who hypnotises them all into seeing “magic”. This really scares Mandy and she saves Sue, who is falling under the spell. Could Mandy be turning into a good ally?

Marvo becomes their teacher, Mr Marco, who hypnotises the class into doing things, such as misbehaving at a hockey match and disgracing the school. Sue has to go along with it so Marvo does not suspect she is immune to his powers. Grand is delighted and looking for higher things from Marvo. But Mandy finds a magazine that reveals Marvo is Grand’s employee. This is something Grand wanted secret, so Mandy decides to use it to blackmail her uncle into keeping his end of the bargain. Then Mandy overhears Marvo telling Grand that he is uneasy about his latest scheme as it sounds dangerous. Mandy, who is beginning to find a conscience, decides to hold onto the magazine so as to stop her uncle in case Marvo decides to go ahead. When it sounds like Marvo and Grand are going to make the girls “disappear” on a picnic and blame it on flying saucers, Mandy and Sue try to use the magazine – but Marvo ends up grabbing it (thanks to those cameras spying on them). Soon after, Grand sends Mandy back to London as he thinks she has outlived his purpose. Sue thinks Mandy deserted her. Sue is now alone, and nobody will listen to her because of her reputation for overactive imagination.

The kidnap gets underway, with a helicopter that the girls have been hypnotised into thinking is a flying saucer. Marvo realises Sue is immune to his powers and tries to deal with her, but she escapes. She tries to get help, so Marvo is forced to release the girls so as not to arouse suspicions. Grand is annoyed at the aborted plan while everyone thinks Sue has been fantasising again.

A doctor advises the Parker parents that Sue be removed from Mr Marco as he feels it is encouraging her fantasy. On television, Mandy sees how miserable Sue is, and tries to get back, but her mother will not let her. Major Grenfield arranges for Sue to share Angela’s private lessons. When snobby Angela rebels against a common person sharing her lessons, the major has a shock for her – she is not a Grenfield but an adopted child. The major tells Sue that Grand was using this information to blackmail him into keeping quiet. Quiet about what? No, the major does not believe what Grand is doing, but he does think the serial is bad for Fame and he is going to tell the villagers this.

Sue sneaks back to school to check up on Marvo, but he spots her. He smashes the classroom and puts the blame on Sue. Her parents think she is really sick and decide to send her away. Then Mandy turns up at her door and they head down to the hall where the major tries to talk the villagers into stopping the filming. Grand asks for, and receives, a week to show that the filming is not harmful. Meanwhile, Angela spots Mandy and Sue and blackmails them into helping her run away. This is her revenge on her grandfather.

Angela takes them to her manor (saying nobody will think of looking for them there), and shows them a secret passage that runs right through the place. Grand is staying here, and Sue realises they can use this to turn the tables on Grand and spy on him. Mandy and Sue overhear Marvo and Grand talking about another plan that will make his serial unstoppable, but they give no details. Meanwhile, the girls have been missed, the police called, and Angela overhears the major making an emotional appeal for his granddaughter on the television. Angela, who is getting fed up with hiding, does listen, but is not ready to return home.

But then Marvo and Grand find them. Angela and Mandy are caught, locked in a vault at the cemetery and left to suffocate. Sue gets away; she is spotted by Jane. Grand advances his grand plan – at the next village meeting, Grand starts a film for Marvo to hypnotise everyone into saying “This serial is good for Fame.” Even Sue seems to be falling under the spell.

But Jane has followed and pulls Sue away, breaking the spell. Sue turns off the electricity, stopping the film. The villagers snap out of it and realise they were being hypnotised. They chase after Marvo and Grand. Sue trips up Grand, and he is caught and arrested. Marvo runs into the path of an oncoming car and ends up in hospital. Angela and Mandy are found in the nick of time with the help of Angela’s dog. Miss Pebblestone is reinstated. The village holds a party with Sue as guest of honour. Sue is a bit sad because Fame will be dreary again. Mandy suggests that Sue use that imagination of hers to liven it up.

This one was a huge favourite with Jinty fans.

Title: Combing Her Golden Hair
Publication: 1/9/79-8/12/79
Reprint: Katie
Artist: Phil Townsend
Writer: Unknown

Plot: Tamsin Tregorren lives with gran (her dad is often away at sea). Gran is a fearsome, iron-willed woman who is very old fashioned and strict with Tamsin. She always seems to keep Tamsin looking a frump in plaits, glasses, and buys her second hand clothes (okay, so they do have a limited budget). She does not even like Tamsin having long hair and only allows it because Dad likes it that way. Tamsin's strict upbringing attracts sympathy from her classmates, who think gran is a dragon and don't come to Tamsin's house for that reason.

There is a mystery about Tamsin’s mother; whenever Tamsin asks questions about her, gran’s temper flares up. Tamsin is not sure she believes what gran says about her mother being dead, and wants to meet her mother. Another problem is that Tamsin yearns to learn to swim, but gran says she cannot because chlorine brings on her asthma, so she cannot join swimming classes at school. She always feels the odd one out.

One night Tamsin’s comb is ruined. She searches gran’s drawer for a spare and finds a silver fish-like comb. When she starts combing her hair, the comb seems to have a strange effect on her. She combs her hair all evening, and she seems to hear a sweet voice calling to her. She also has a strange, calming feeling, as if she is floating on water. But gran is not impressed to find Tamsin combing her hair all evening. She goes berserk, calling it vanity, which is a sin, and threatens to cut Tamsin’s hair off. But the comb starts inciting Tamsin to go against her gran. She starts wearing some fashionable clothes with the help of her friends. They also help her to have a go at swimming but gran stops her, screaming about her asthma problem, and drags her out in front of her friends.

Still, the attempt has Tamsin wondering if she really has a problem with chlorine. Then a new teacher insists on pupils producing doctor’s certificates if they are to be excused swimming. But gran will not even take Tamsin to the doctor to get one. Rather, she will keep Tamsin at home on swimming days, even though it is illegal and gran could get in trouble. But the comb encourages Tamsin to swim, and she starts doing so in secret at school with the help of her friend Ellen, and without gran knowing. And when she does, she finds she is a natural swimmer and there is no reaction to the chlorine.

There is another scene when gran catches Tamsin combing her hair. This time she almost cuts Tamsin’s hair off for real. But Dad, who has returned from the sea, intervenes. He says, “Oh Mother, I realise why you tried to do it, but cutting off her lovely hair is going too far!” But he will not tell Tamsin what he meant by knowing the reason for gran's actions. This deepens the mystery that Tamsin is now more determined to solve.

An eye test (something gran had always kept Tamsin away from) reveals that there is nothing wrong with her eyes and Tamsin discovers the glasses her gran buys her are just plain glass. She now realises the glasses, plaits and everything else frumpy were intended to de-emphasise her looks because gran considers beauty a sin. Furious, she smashes her glasses and starts wearing her hair loose. When she confronts her father over the matter, he is oddly defensive about gran's actions. Still, Gran is forced to agree to allow Tamsin to wear her hair loose. However, she confiscates all mirrors in the house to discourage any vanity in Tamsin, but Tamsin defies her with a broken mirror in the shed. This time, when she combs her hair, the comb says a name: Redruthan. Later, Tamsin discovers Redruthan is a place in Cornwall. When she mentions Redruthan, and more questions about Mum to Dad and gran, they both clam up oddly, saying that she and her mother originated in London. Now Tamsin is even more determined to find out about her mother.

Gran discovers Tamsin's secret swimming. She really flips out, cutting up the swimming costume and towel and locks Tamsin in the broom cupboard. She also says something odd about lying being in Tamsin’s blood. Tamsin realises this can only mean her mother, as her father is honest. The comb comforts Tamsin again, saying happiness can begin in Redruthan. Then Tamsin discovers her birth certificate, which says she was born at Gull Cottage, Redruthan. So much for London origins.

Then gran falls sick and has a bad attack. Tamsin is also having second thoughts about the comb, realising it has brought problems for her in encouraging her to defy her gran. She turns to looking after her gran, but eventually gran is taken to hospital. The comb takes Tamsin over again and and urges her to head to Redruthan. This time, Tamsin cannot resist the call, although gran could be on the danger list and needs her badly. She goes Ellen’s house, as she and her parents are heading to Redruthan on holiday. She takes a replacement swimming costume Ellen left for her and sneaks a lift there in the back of their caravan. When she arrives in Redruthan, she feels she belongs there. People are astonished to see a girl running about in a swim costume in cold weather, but Tamsin does not feel cold in it – she feels alive.

Tamsin finds Gull Cottage, and learns that she, gran, Dad and Mum lived there when she was a baby, and locals think there was something funny about them. Her mother did not get on with gran and then disappeared. The comb then leads Tamsin to a mirror that matches it.

Meanwhile, gran discovers what Tamsin has done. Although she is still sick, she leaves hospital and comes to Redruthan, saying she is trying to save Tamsin. Ellen is in tow. Ellen is appalled at how sick gran looks, but gran is determined to save Tamsin. She always did have a will of iron.

Tamsin comes face to face with her mother – and discovers she is a mermaid!

Now see how it all ends. It's not quite the ending you might have expected.

If the list isn't quite full, I'd say "Combing Her Golden Hair" should be in the top 100 - it's another one I overlooked, but deserves to be on the list. The story built up steadily over the weeks, was well paced and had a great ending.

Yes, I agree that 'Golden Hair' is particularly intriguing. Whatever her Gran might say about Tamsin being human and therefore unable to survive in the sea the fact remains that she is half-mermaid by birth. The idea that her mother wants her to drown seems quite illogical to me - however cold and self-obsessed she might be. It would've been interesting to see a sequel in which Tamsin confronted her dual heritage - a bit like a female version of Marvel's Sub-Mariner or DC's Aquaman.

I must say that you've done brilliantly to reach this stage Tammyfan. If I'm honest I thought that finding 100 worthy serials would prove to be an impossibly tall order when you started out, yet you've managed to see it through with admirable determination and skill. Having said that I agree that there are bound to be some quibbles about what was included in the first draft and what wasn't - the main problem being that it's inevitable there will be many worthy contenders that most of us have never even seen yet. Personally I can't see any problem with involving somebody like Pat Mills - especially if he can give an idea of which strips were most popular with readers when they appeared. Also a mention on his blog could persuade more people to join in - something that would enable the list to become increasingly representative.

I am inclined to agree with Phoenix that it might be a good idea to have a short breathing space before making any changes however. Looking at the list as it stands it occurs to me that it could easily be subdivided into those strips that are totally secure (Angel, Valda, The Happy Days), and others - like Vanessa from Venus - that have yet to be defended adequately. Maybe it'd be possible to give every one of the hundred a thread of its own (each one prefixed with a 'Top 100' label) including sample pages and a plot outline so that visitors to Comics UK can add their own opinions; in many cases the material for these threads would just need to be copied from earlier posts. Then we could have a separate prefix for 'Top 100 Contenders' which could go head-to-head against the weaker centurions - rather like football teams facing promotion or relegation at the end of the season!

Wherever you go from here it's my experience that this sort of list tends to be just the sort of thing publishers love - regardless of how limited the voting base might be. In the future don't be at all surprised to see journalists grandly mentioning that certain strips 'have been voted among the 100 best ever'...!

- Phil Rushton

Tammyfan wrote:Pat Mills was a very useful authority when the top tens for Tammy and Jinty were compiled.

It can't have escaped anybody's notice, Tammyfan, that without any preamble, and at the rate of one per day, and at a time when they weren't actually required, you have posted synopses of significant length to three Fleetway serials, all of which have enough about them to have put them in the frame for inclusion in the Top 100, had they been posted earlier. I have three questions.

1. In which left field did you discover them?
2. Why did you not mention them when you were asking for candidates to fill the last 25/15/10 spots?
3. What positions did they have in the Tammy/Jinty Top 10s?

To satisfy my conspiracy theorist, your answer to 2. should be as far away as possible from, I forgot them, as they are clearly unforgettable.
To prevent me from prostrating myself in despair on my lounge carpet, especially as I have tonsillitis and I don't really have the energy, try to avoid telling me that your earlier judgements have been in any way swayed by phone/text/thought-transference messages from Pat Mills.

@ Phoenix: I shall not answer to your comments as you're not well. Hope you get better soon. I've been having problems myself, with an infected ear. As for Pat Milks, I haven't even heard back from him yet.

Everyone: Glad you like Combing Her Golden Hair. The Jinty classics I have shown you were published in the years when Jinty was at her peak under Mavis. Miller. Before she lost some of her lustre when Mavis left. You may recall us discussing this on another thread. I'll show you a couple more stories and then put the collection away.

Hmm, competition on the top 100 is getting extremely fierce. Perhaps you're right and we need to take a pause soon and reflect on what to do.

Yes, our list is something publishers would love. Wonder if anyone else is thinking of a top 100?