"Thunder and Jet" Why only 22?

[alanultron5]

I know somewhere on this forum that someone stated that "Jet" comic only ran 22 issues so that sucessful stories in it could be transferred to other IPC titles! This may apply to "Thunder" too!

However-and not wanting to disbelieve anyone - I do puzzlw why this might be? Surely it was ecomomic suicide to only plan a so short a life for publications? Could IPC really have been so mercenary?

With "Jet" I could just believe it possible, but not so with "Thunder". I say this having many issues of "Thunder" which unlike "Jet" (I have all 22 of that title) had a letters page with a great rapport with its readers!

The comic not only answered readers letters, but gave very precise details about artists and writers of its content. It told readers of new strips to come in the comic and gave advance details of a forthcoming London comic & artists fair!

To me, this hardly sounds like a comic specially designed for a short life! To go by the readers letters, virtually every "Thunder" strip was very popular indeed with "Adam Eterno" "The Black Max" and "The Steel Commando" especially praised!

Has anyone any views on this?

[tony ingram]

Both Star-Lord and Tornado also only ran 22 issues each. Hmm...

[grumpy old man]

Perhaps 22 is the comic worlds equivalent of 27?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/27_Club

[felneymike]

I beleive Tornado was created to "use up" leftover stories from Action and something else. But yes, back then they did plan short-lived publications, the idea being that they'd pitch them at a slightly different market to a sucessful comic, get readers and then merge them, hoping that most of the readers would carry on with the comic it merged into.

[alanultron5]

If that `is` the reason Felneymike, its treating the readership a bit harsh! I know that I certainly identified with "Thunder" and felt it was `my comic` Even though it provided the majority of stories for the combined `Lion & Thunder` the comic was `in all but name` swallowed up! Lion seemed to be a comic well past its prime! My feeling was that if `Thunder` was selling better why not let it live?

Of course, I don't know if `Thunder` was outselling `Lion` in 1970 as circulation figures (Rather like music sales) of those days wern't divulged to the readership!

[Lew Stringer]

Lion seemed to be a comic well past its prime! My feeling was that if `Thunder` was selling better why not let it live?

Of course, I don't know if `Thunder` was outselling `Lion` in 1970 as circulation figures (Rather like music sales) of those days wern't divulged to the readership!

The feeling was that the older title should have seniority, even if its sales were lower, just because it was a more recognizable name.

Why end after 22 weeks? Well, comics back then were produced eight weeks in advance, so by the time they had disappointing figures on issues 1 to 8 they'd be working on issues 9 to 16. Then they'd need another few weeks to wind up certain stories and "match and dispatch" the comics.

[steelclaw]

I loved Thunder as well.

How my comic collecting got from Thunder to Eagle weekly.



TO




I hope to collect all comics published from Thunder to Eagle I have a few Hundred but need lots more to complete.

THUNDER(FIRST ONE) October 17th 1970
THUNDER(LAST ONE)March 13th 1971
LION AND THUNDER(FIRST ONE) March 20th 1971
LION AND THUNDER(LAST ONE) May 18th 1974
VALIANT AND LION(FIRST ONE) May 25th 1974
VALIANT AND LION(LAST ONE) March 22nd 1975
VALIANT 29th March 1975 to 3rd April 1975
VALIANT AND VULCAN(FIRST ONE)April 10th 1976
VALIANT AND VULCAN(LAST ONE)October 2nd 1976
VALIANT October 9th To October 16th 1976
BATTLE AND VALIANT(FIRST ONE)October 23rd 1976
BATTLE AND VALIANT(LAST ONE)(October 1st 1977
BATTLE October 8th 1977 to November 12th 1977
BATTLE - ACTION(FIRST ONE)November 19th 1977
BATTLE - ACTION LAST ONE 25th July 1981
BATTLE - August 1st 1981 To October 1st 1983
BATTLE ACTION FORCE(FIRST ONE) October 8th 1983
BATTLE ACTION FORCE(LAST ONE)November 29th 1986
BATTLE - December 6th 1986 To January 17th 1987
BATTLE STORM FORCE(FIRST ONE)January 24th 1987
BATTLE STORM FORCE(LAST ONE)January 23rd 1988
EAGLE 2 AND BATTLE(FIRST ONE) January 30th 1988
EAGLE 2 AND BATTLE(LAST ONE)May 28th 1988
EAGLE 2 June 4th To October 22nd 1988
EAGLE AND MASK(FIRST ONE)October 29th 1988
EAGLE AND MASK(LAST ONE)March 25th 1989
EAGLE 2 April 1st 1989(One Issue)
EAGLE AND WILDCAT(FIRST ONE)April 8th 1989
EAGLE AND WILDCATLAST ONE)July 15th 1989
EAGLE 2 July 22nd 1989 To April 6th 1991(LAST WEEKLY)


THE NEW EAGLE MONTHLY May 1991 (FIRST ONE)
THE NEW EAGLE MONTHLY(LAST ONE 33 ISSUES) January 1994

[felneymike]

If that `is` the reason Felneymike, its treating the readership a bit harsh!

Hmm, well perhaps saying they "planned" for a comic to be merged is a bit strong, if they'd started something and it turned out to be wildly sucessful they would have kept it going XD

[alanultron5]

That's my pint Felneymike! I have 16 issues of `Thunder` and they did get a great deal of feedback from the readers! Not just the regular letters, but in a section where the `Sam` character answers questions re artists, plot devices, new stories etc!

It may be due to the strike that hit many IPC titles in late 1970. Though `Thunder` seemingly wasn't affected, perhaps IPC could only get out a limited run of issues 16 to 22 - those issues virtually never come up for sale!

Unlike `Jet` which had no letters page or readers forum, `Thunder` did have an ongoing discourse with its readers. Almost every Thunder strip was highly praised, unusual in a comic I think!

I just can't figure out any real commercial reason for its decline-but then again, I was never in the comic industry, so what do I know!!

[Lew Stringer]

I just can't figure out any real commercial reason for its decline-but then again, I was never in the comic industry, so what do I know!!

Neither was I when I was 12 but I could see that both Thunder and Jet were weaker comics than Valiant, Lion and Tiger. Sure, there were strong stories such as Black Max, Adam Eterno and Von Hoffman's Invasion but there were also a bunch of weak strips holding the comics back. Jet Skaters? Cliff Hanger? Paddy McGinty's Goat? Hardly the stuff for a 1970s audience who would soon welcome Battle Picture Weekly, Action and 2000AD.

As for positive readers' letters; voice of the minority. A dozen constructive letters is nothing compared to the hundreds of thousands of readers that a comic needed to survive back then.

[tony ingram]

Lion seemed to be a comic well past its prime! My feeling was that if `Thunder` was selling better why not let it live?

Of course, I don't know if `Thunder` was outselling `Lion` in 1970 as circulation figures (Rather like music sales) of those days wern't divulged to the readership!

The feeling was that the older title should have seniority, even if its sales were lower, just because it was a more recognizable name.

Why end after 22 weeks? Well, comics back then were produced eight weeks in advance, so by the time they had disappointing figures on issues 1 to 8 they'd be working on issues 9 to 16. Then they'd need another few weeks to wind up certain stories and "match and dispatch" the comics.

It was the same situation with Star-Lord, wasn't it? It was actually a very popular comic, but was still folded into 2000AD. A shame, since at the time Star-Lord was definitely the better of the two...

[philcom55]

I think Pat Mills has stated that the failure of Jag (which itself lasted for less than a year), following all the high hopes with which it was launched, demoralized the editorial staff at Fleetway/IPC. After that it was felt in some quarters that the traditional Valiant-style format was living on borrowed time and that, short of temporary gimmicks to bolster the existing circulations, the only possible future for boys' adventure comics lay with radical experiments such as Battle, Action and 2000AD.

- Phil Rushton

[Digifiend]

Vindicated decision. Which one of their boys adventure titles is the last survivor... 2000AD (albeit under different ownership).

[tony ingram]

Vindicated decision. Which one of their boys adventure titles is the last survivor... 2000AD (albeit under different ownership).

Well, Commando seems to be doing OK. And that's about as tradityional as you can possibly get...

[Digifiend]

I said their... as in Fleetway/IPC. Commando is a DC Thomson comic.